Fees skyrocketed?

As someone who trades quite frequently on Bisq I agree. 48BSQ / 2BTC was quite high but bearable but 76BSQ / 2BTC is going to massively reduce how much I trade on Bisq.

Also what is with the BSQ fee being almost the same as the BTC fee. surely that doesn’t encourage people to use BSQ at all?

image

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I understand that BSQ created and BSQ burned must be in equilibrium in order for the DAO concept to work.

To balance this equation either

  • more BSQ have to be burned with the current transactions or
  • more transaction burning BSQ must be executed.

During the last cycles the parameters for the former has been tweaked. With the introduction of the new account signing procedure the latter would be addressed and the substantial growth of the BISQ network with new users will be possible again (in the SEPA EUR market).

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The fees have been adjusted back to th 0.4% target as we had before the DAO launch (0,1% for maker, 0,3% for taker). The BTC fees are about 50% higher to encourage that people use BSQ and give the DAO a economically sustainable basis (e.g. to find enough developers/contributors to work on Bisq).

When the USD value of the BSQ fee is dislayed we use the latest BSQ/BTC -> BTC/USD rates. If the last BSQ trade was very high or very low that conversion can lead to numbers which are not in the intended range (as in @eeeper’s screenshot). The 1 USD/BSQ rate is still the average as far I saw, so mostly the fee should be in the intended range.

@eeeper 76 BSQ is with the average price about 76 USD not 111 USD and with a 2 BTC trade its about 0.3-0.4% taker fee, depending on the BTC price.

@invertedbob

I’ve personally paid well over $300.000 in Bisq fees just this month,

I doubt that is possible. You can check the BTC fees by looking on the 2 arbitrator addresses and the burned BSQ is visible in the app. All BSQ burned since April is about 60 000 BSQ (about 60 000 USD) and the average BTC fees paid to arbitratos have been in average about 2 BTC/ month in total, so that is roughly 20 000 USD/month.

Mining fees need to be kept out but miner fees are rather low over the last weeks luckily.

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@ManfredKarrer Yes of course, shifted the decimal point a little too much. Corrected my original post. Should have noticed while writing.

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That still sounds too much, 30k is probably the whole revenue in fee (btc+bsq) in one month as we had been below 0.4%.

But anyway, thanks for being open about your concerns. The voting on fees will be an ongoing process and users are invited to discuss on the github proposals and/or partizipate in dao voting.

The 0.3% for taker might be too high and there have been voices to change to 0.15+0.25 instead. Bisq is governed by the DAO and all who partizipate will form it. Feel free to take that opportunity.

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I really want to emphasis this: Bisq is not a company, its an open source project with a decentralized governance and funding model (DAO). Contributors on one side who provide work to enable trading and traders on the other side using it. It is a synergy, not 2 opposing sides and the DAO brings both in the same boat. DAO voting is permissionless and open and traders should partizipate. But not only in voting but in the discussion process as well.

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What aspects would incentivize traders to participate in voting? Other than the fee rate.
Maybe a notification popup would be useful when there are new proposals that need voting.

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New trader on BISQ in the last two weeks and I love the platform. I 100% agree with invertedbob about the fees doubling being quite a problem for the market makers. It’s a tough trade off on where to set fees so that the exchange is making enough but not too high that it stifles volume. I would say at the current level you will chase off too much volume and end up collecting lower revenues. I guess we will see if that is what happens. If the goal is to get people to trade on BISQ, you have to first make it market-maker friendly as they are populating your order book. Then, when a prospective user logs in, they see an offer that they like and decide to move BTC to the BISQ wallet. Higher fees just equal higher trading friction, and this new level may cause the market to seize up. It sounds like in the XMR market, you have already scared off many of the former customers.

Just my 2 cents and meant to be constructive criticism, I absolutely love the BISQ project and the functional exchange that has been created thus far. I’m committed to helping it grow into something more useful for customers. :slight_smile:

Please see a summary of fees and fee increases in this blog post.

As mentioned before in this thread, fees are not any higher than they have always been on Bisq. Small exception for recent few weeks since the bitcoin price dipped below 12 000 USD, but nothing extreme.